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 Post subject: Re: Daytime MOT requirements
PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2016 12:34 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2011 2:35 pm
Posts: 412
Location: Somerset
johnnyboxer wrote:
Riding a bike that passes an mot, but doesn't comply with Construction & Use regulations is ok until you get caught or you are involved in a serious or fatal RTC (whether you are at fault or not)

The Police and Courts will go through your bike with a fine tooth comb to prove negligence or culpability - even if it wasn't entirely your own fault that caused the accident

Also your insurance may be invalidated if your bike doesn't meet Construction & Use legality

Why chance it?


Which Construction & Use regulation am I not complying with? Please be specific.

[quote="Hugh Cleary"]Greetings,

We can discuss the finer arguments of this light scenario until the cows come home, but may I just ask that you consider your family and the Police officer who has to tell them of your 'accident' because somebody else made a mistake and has wiped you out :idea: Modern roads and traffic conditions are not very supportive of motorcycling :!:

The "finer argument of this light scenario" that I am advocating is riding with lights on in the daytime. How is that "failing to consider my family and the police officer.....etc"?

This is becoming a little like the Referendum debate, with unsubstantiated opinion being stated as though it were fact, and prophesies of doom, death and court action being bandied about with no facts to back up the statements.

The facts are:
I am riding a motorcycle with a front and rear position lamp and a brake light, in daylight. The motorcycle has an MOT advisory stating 'no lights fitted at time of test'.

If someone can please give reference to a specific regulation that is being breached by this scenario, then please do so


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 Post subject: Re: Daytime MOT requirements
PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:02 pm 
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400 cc

Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:50 pm
Posts: 1122
Location: Yorkshire
cee-b wrote:
johnnyboxer wrote:
Riding a bike that passes an mot, but doesn't comply with Construction & Use regulations is ok until you get caught or you are involved in a serious or fatal RTC (whether you are at fault or not)

The Police and Courts will go through your bike with a fine tooth comb to prove negligence or culpability - even if it wasn't entirely your own fault that caused the accident

Also your insurance may be invalidated if your bike doesn't meet Construction & Use legality

Why chance it?


Which Construction & Use regulation am I not complying with? Please be specific.


The facts are:
I am riding a motorcycle with a front and rear position lamp and a brake light, in daylight. The motorcycle has an MOT advisory stating 'no lights fitted at time of test'.

If someone can please give reference to a specific regulation that is being breached by this scenario, then please do so[/color]


Well for a start, you haven't got brake light operated by both front and rear brakes and your headlight doesn't dip

If your lights weren't present at your MOT test, why have you re-fitted/unblanked them?

Why not leave them off altogether and save the weight

They're are not necessary for a daytime MOT ..............so why bother?

_________________
2003 Honda XR400R3
1996 Suzuki DR350SE


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 Post subject: Re: Daytime MOT requirements
PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:34 pm 
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650 cc Monster
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Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2012 2:22 pm
Posts: 2439
Location: Romiley
Greetings,

I think that the legislation is covered by 'The Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989 revised 2016', a copy of which can be found at; http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1989 ... ule/1/made

The problem is that none of us is a Judge and so we can not be specific, it might also be worth bearing in mind that none of is is judging any body else either but simply offering advice which can be taken or left as seen fit by the reader.

It should be borne in mind that Construction and Use Legislation is different to the requirements for passing an MOT and in my experience it is the C&U that is normally quoted. All legislation is constantly reviewed and updated and I have been out of that line for too long now.

I am not trying to inflict my opinions upon anybody.

TTFN

Hugh.

_________________
Please note that I am not a National TRF Officer, any views expressed are my own and may not be in accordance with any official policy.


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 Post subject: Re: Daytime MOT requirements
PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2016 10:01 pm 
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200 cc

Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2011 2:35 pm
Posts: 412
Location: Somerset
The facts are:
I am riding a motorcycle with a front and rear position lamp and a brake light, in daylight. The motorcycle has an MOT advisory stating 'no lights fitted at time of test'.

If someone can please give reference to a specific regulation that is being breached by this scenario, then please do so[/color][/quote]

johnnyboxer wrote:

Well for a start, you haven't got brake light operated by both front and rear brakes and your headlight doesn't dip

If your lights weren't present at your MOT test, why have you re-fitted/unblanked them?

Why not leave them off altogether and save the weight

They're are not necessary for a daytime MOT ..............so why bother?[/quote]

Lots of opinion and bluster, not a single fact - hardly worth a reasoned response
Hugh Cleary wrote:
Greetings,

I think that the legislation is covered by 'The Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989 revised 2016', a copy of which can be found at; http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1989 ... ule/1/made

The problem is that none of us is a Judge and so we can not be specific, it might also be worth bearing in mind that none of is is judging any body else either but simply offering advice which can be taken or left as seen fit by the reader.

It should be borne in mind that Construction and Use Legislation is different to the requirements for passing an MOT and in my experience it is the C&U that is normally quoted. All legislation is constantly reviewed and updated and I have been out of that line for too long now.

I am not trying to inflict my opinions upon anybody.

TTFN

Hugh.


Thanks for that Hugh,
as far as I can ascertain, these are the relevant Construction & Use regulations:


Statutory Instruments

1989 No. 1796

ROAD TRAFFIC
The Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989

(Regulations 18 and 20)
SCHEDULE 2
Requirements relating to obligatory front position lamps and to optional front position lamps to the extent specified in part i

PART II
Requirements relating to optional front position lamps

1. In the case of a solo motor bicycle first used on or after 1st April 1991 which is not fitted with any obligatory front position lamp, not more than two may be fitted which must comply with the requirement specified in paragraph 7 of Part I. Where two are fitted these shall be situated as close together as possible.

PART I
7. Colour: White or, if incorporated in a headlamp which is capable of emitting only a yellow light, yellow

PART II
Requirements relating to optional dim-dip devices and running lamps

There is no requirement relating to an optional dim-dip device or an optional running lamp.

PART II
Requirements relating to optional rear position lamps

Any number may be fitted and the only requirement prescribed by these Regulations in respect of any which are fitted is that specified in paragraph 7 of Part I.

PART I
7. Colour: Red

SCHEDULE 12
PART I Requirements relating to obligatory stop lamps and to optional stop lamps to the extent specified in part ii

PART II Requirements relating to optional stop lamps

Any number may be fitted, and the requirements prescribed by these Regulations in respect of any which are fitted are all those specified in Part I except–

(a) those specified in paragraphs 1, 2 and 3; and

(b) in the case of a stop lamp fitted to a pedal cycle, those specified in paragraphs 5 and 8; and

(c) in the case of a stop lamp fitted to a motor vehicle not being a motor bicycle, first used on or after 1st April 1991 either centrally or in such a manner as to project light through the rear window the intensity of the light emitted to the rear of the vehicle shall be not less than 20 candelas and not more than 60 candelas when measured from directly behind the centre of the lamp in a direction parallel to the longitudinal axis of the vehicle.

PART I
1. Number. A solo motor bicycle, a motor bicycle combination, an invalid carriage and a trailer drawn by a solo motor bicycle or a motor bicycle combination: One


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 Post subject: Re: Daytime MOT requirements
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 2:35 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 10:53 am
Posts: 189
Wouldn't it just be easier to call into your local testing centre and have a word with the guy, all the ones I've ever met are more than happy to discuss requirements..but just for the record my DRZ400e has no main beam, just dipped beam on all the time, I never taped anything up, I have a rear light, and brake light on the front brake only, battery horn, as in AA batteries, no indicators ...mine passed the test ok, just an advisory for front wheel bearings a bit noisy...of course all test stations vary even though they shouldn't and just because a bike passes an MOT that still doesn't mean it's road legal..tyre tread depth is a good one for that if I recall correctly...


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 Post subject: Re: Daytime MOT requirements
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 7:31 pm 
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Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2012 7:31 pm
Posts: 3512
Woodywoodster wrote:
Wouldn't it just be easier to call into your local testing centre and have a word with the guy, all the ones I've ever met are more than happy to discuss requirements..but just for the record my DRZ400e has no main beam, just dipped beam on all the time, I never taped anything up, I have a rear light, and brake light on the front brake only, battery horn, as in AA batteries, no indicators ...mine passed the test ok, just an advisory for front wheel bearings a bit noisy...of course all test stations vary even though they shouldn't and just because a bike passes an MOT that still doesn't mean it's road legal..tyre tread depth is a good one for that if I recall correctly...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Don't be such a killjoy, people like to post the letter of the law verbatim , I on the other hand, sleep real well at night....yeah ! Stickin it to the man !


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 Post subject: Re: Daytime MOT requirements
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 8:57 pm 
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200 cc

Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2011 2:35 pm
Posts: 412
Location: Somerset
Joel wrote:
Woodywoodster wrote:
Wouldn't it just be easier to call into your local testing centre and have a word with the guy, all the ones I've ever met are more than happy to discuss requirements..but just for the record my DRZ400e has no main beam, just dipped beam on all the time, I never taped anything up, I have a rear light, and brake light on the front brake only, battery horn, as in AA batteries, no indicators ...mine passed the test ok, just an advisory for front wheel bearings a bit noisy...of course all test stations vary even though they shouldn't and just because a bike passes an MOT that still doesn't mean it's road legal..tyre tread depth is a good one for that if I recall correctly...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Don't be such a killjoy, people like to post the letter of the law verbatim , I on the other hand, sleep real well at night....yeah ! Stickin it to the man !


I'm entirely with your sentiment Joel; I have been riding the bike as described for the past few years without giving it more than a passing thought.
I posted the letter of the law (that I was directed to) simply to come back at the "you can't do that/it is illegal/it is dangerous/how would the TRF defend.../the rules state etc etc etc" posts and to show that, actually, it is perfectly legal and that much of what is being posted as fact is simply misinformation and blather.


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 Post subject: Re: Daytime MOT requirements
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 9:02 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 28, 2009 6:57 pm
Posts: 1301
So just a normal day at the office then, or forum in this case :?

Rod


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 Post subject: Re: Daytime MOT requirements
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 9:16 pm 
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650 cc Monster

Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2012 7:31 pm
Posts: 3512
Ha,ha...we need a tedium moderator...or is that me ?


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 Post subject: Re: Daytime MOT requirements
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 9:57 pm 
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Posts: 1301
I'll have to leave it to you Joel, I've got 3 days trail riding to do :D

Rod


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