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 Post subject: Re: BETA ALP 4.0 - a trailbike
PostPosted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 11:40 pm 
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80 cc

Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 12:57 pm
Posts: 90
Like the master cylinder guard. I've got a Beta Alp 200 which I've had for years, I'm going to have a quick look and see if the guard will work for my bike. The fixings (bolts etc) on the 200 rust and shear compared with my other Hondas. Never tried the Alp 350.

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Andrew Brocklehurst
Cumbria Group TRF


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 Post subject: Re: BETA ALP 4.0 - a trailbike
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2015 4:13 pm 
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80 cc

Joined: Thu Jul 16, 2015 10:41 am
Posts: 13
Location: Teesdale
Collected the Beta on Saturday morning (in my pick-up) and took for a run out yesterday. It seemed to be going very well but after about 5 miles the engine started to momentarily die on a number of occasions as if fuel had just been cut off. Needless to say, there was plenty of fuel in and as I nursed it home there were also a couple of back-fires.

Got back and checked the plug which was a little sooty but not too bad. Gave that a clean and was wondering if anyone else has suggestions on what to check before I give it another run. Is there a fuel filter? It will start from cold and sound sweet as a nut so it is not an instant problem. The bike is 10 years old but has only covered 900 miles so has obviously stood a lot.

Thomas


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 Post subject: Re: BETA ALP 4.0 - a trailbike
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:20 pm 
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80 cc

Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 12:57 pm
Posts: 90
Hi Thomas

Things that come to mind (no particular order):
1. Water in the tank/stale fuel due to standing? Try dumping the fuel and refilling and putting in an in-line fuel filter between the fuel tap and the carb (few pounds).
2. Condenser?
3. Might as well fit a new plug to eliminate that as a possible problem, have a look at the condition of the plug cap, might not work as well once engine is warm?
4. Air/fuel mix on carb.
5. My Alp 200 sucked up water from a puddle through the (very long) overflow drain tube on the bottom of the carb. Trimming it eliminated the problem!
6. Float level incorrect, so starving fuel at full revs over extended period?

Hope that helps.

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Cumbria Group TRF


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 Post subject: Re: BETA ALP 4.0 - a trailbike
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2015 8:09 pm 
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80 cc

Joined: Thu Jul 16, 2015 10:41 am
Posts: 13
Location: Teesdale
Thanks Andrew - I will address each suggested item in turn.

I have just noticed that the bike was overfilled on oil to the tune of about 3/4 of a paper coffee cup as this is how much I drained out of the lower oil level check screw. Not sure if that could be a factor?

The engine seems to be running very hot compared to what I am used to and this heat could be causing fuel evaporation in a line perhaps. The only thing I can think of to make it run too hot is the timing.

Thomas


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 Post subject: Re: BETA ALP 4.0 - a trailbike
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2015 8:54 pm 
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650 cc Monster
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Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2012 2:22 pm
Posts: 2439
Location: Romiley
Greetings Thomas,

With regards to your carburettor you might like to take a look at a post I put up some time ago back,http://www.trf.org.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=18173&start=20&hilit=carburettor

Fit new seals and gaskets and inspect the air intake hose to air filter box for security and possible splits. The air filter can be washed in a degreaser fluid such as Jizer, wash with warm soapy water, air dry or with compressed air and then the filter coated with K&N aerosol spray.

Really, wether it needs it or not, I would suggest that you carry out a full service of the fuel system, plus the whole bike so that you familiarise yourself with where all the various parts are situated. Trust me it gives confidence and saves time if you were unlikely to have problems en route.

The carburettor is easy enough to remove and to work on, with obvious caveats about cleanliness and 'sharp' screwdrivers. I cleaned mine in a sonic bath which I bought from Aldi and cleaner fluid from Maplin.

The fuel tap has a filter but I replaced the complete tap which has a Reserve position, far more useful than a warning light in my view. I got the tap from Steve Goode as a direct replacement, good service too.

I replaced the original spark plug, kept as a spare, and replaced it with an NGK Iridium, costs a little more but last longer and operate under harsher conditions.

The handlebar switch gear I stripped, cleaned with aerosol brake & clutch cleaner, sprayed it all with aerosol lube plus coated it all with silicon grease, available from a plumbers merchant. The switches are quite clunky and the spring loaded balls have a tendency to stick.

Disconnect all the electrical contacts that you can find, thoroughly clean them with B&C cleaner, silicon and fit them together securely, any doubt use a backup tie cable. Thoroughly recharge the battery, preferably with one of the new type of chargers - I use an Optimate 6 which is worth every penny. The battery is fitted permanently with an extra charging lead, which I connect after every ride.

Remember that an additional oil filter is fitted just below the headstock, the frame has an extra drain screw on the right above the carburettor, try to drain when their is warm/hot so that it flows out easier. The system is 'dry sump' and so you can only check the oil level after the engine has been running for about 10 minutes. Drain it all, replace the paper filter and its seals (I used genuine Suzuki items) and replenish with 2 litres of new oil, run the engine and then recheck the dip stick.

In my opinion the engine does run 'hot' in comparison to other bikes but it is an air cooled unit which relies also on plenty of oil flow, hence the need to use clean oil. I use semi synthetic Rock motorcycle oil, never use car oil. The inside of my right calf feels the heat as the exhaust runs close to the frame.

If you still have problems then come back to us and we will try to guide you further.

TTFN

Hugh.

Ps forgot to mention that I extended the breather to run up under the tank, before looping back to just above the engine, I left the overflow pipe as original so that if the carb flooded it would drain safely. The breather pipe has to be kept away from possible water ingress and I have been through some really deep water with this bike. The fuel filler cap is a naff design and will allow water in to the tank if you remove the filler after a day running in the rain, :!: , so periodically drain the tank thoroughly by removing the tap completely.

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Please note that I am not a National TRF Officer, any views expressed are my own and may not be in accordance with any official policy.


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 Post subject: Re: BETA ALP 4.0 - a trailbike
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 7:42 am 
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80 cc

Joined: Thu Jul 16, 2015 10:41 am
Posts: 13
Location: Teesdale
Many thanks Hugh - sounds like I am going to be busy!

I agree, it is probably wise to go over everything as a familiarisation exercise as well as to iron out any issues. Although the bike has done very little mileage (average of 80 a year!) it has obviously stood unused for long periods which can sometimes be worse than regular use and perhaps due to its low use the previous owners have not felt the need for regular service.

I can see from the manual that there is an idle control screw (at the end of a short rubber pipe) but is this also mixture control?

Thomas


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 Post subject: Re: BETA ALP 4.0 - a trailbike
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 8:55 am 
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650 cc Monster

Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2009 3:08 pm
Posts: 4440
No

The mix control is the little flat screw on the side of the carb.


To set it, warm the engine, then turn the big screw till the engine is at a fast tick-over (2000 rpm, or so).

Then turn the little screw very slightly back & forth (usually its between half and one and a half turns out from fully in) until the engine rpms peak.

Then turn the big screw back out to restore your normal desired tickover.


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 Post subject: Re: BETA ALP 4.0 - a trailbike
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 9:41 am 
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650 cc Monster
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Joined: Fri Aug 14, 2009 8:34 am
Posts: 5141
Location: East Sussex
If my KTM 950 was anything to go by, the inside of your carb is probably a good potato growing medium.

Modern ethanol'ed petrol is horrid stuff and should be banned as it attacks pretty much anything it touches.
Can easily be fixed with some chemicals (Frosts Ethomix for example) but we shouldn't have to do that - it should come from the refinery.
I was told they only load the tankers at the last minute because of the damage the ethanol does.

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 Post subject: Re: BETA ALP 4.0 - a trailbike
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 4:23 pm 
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80 cc

Joined: Thu Jul 16, 2015 10:41 am
Posts: 13
Location: Teesdale
Got my carb off and have had a good look/clean around (thanks to Hugh's detailed photographic post!). There was a little bit of muck in there but nothing that was an obvious problem.

Ref. the idle mixture screw which is on the bottom of the carb - afraid that I made the error of taking this out to check without referencing its position before hand. Is there a standard number of turns from fully in that sets this correctly or if not, what is the procedure for setting mixture correctly once back on the bike?

Other points to note - the wire from the side of the carb was already disconnected as recommended and the plug on the end was just tucked under a cable tie on the frame.

Thomas


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 Post subject: Re: BETA ALP 4.0 - a trailbike
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 4:42 pm 
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650 cc Monster

Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2009 3:08 pm
Posts: 4440
Start with it one turn out...the usual optimum spot is between half-a-turn and one-and-a half turns if the rest of the carb is set up properly. Half-a-turn is a major adjustment here.

It's best to do the carb last: ie after making sure that ignition timing and valve clearances etc are spot-on.


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